Sarah Palin: The other bridge to nowhere

Charlie Burr

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John McCain's pick of Sarah Palin is ultimately about his decision making and judgment. Palin could be effective on the campaign trail or an absolute disaster, but what does it say about McCain that he would put Palin a heartbeat away from the presidency after only meeting her once?

If we've learned nothing else from the last eight years, it's that when politicians make gut decisions without thinking things through, it can have disastrous consequences for our country. Choosing a running mate after only one meeting? George W. Bush decision making at its worst.

Presidents sometimes must make difficult, complex choices on a moment's notice. But this decision was an unforced error -- how many months ago did McCain effectively wrap up his nomination? It's stunning that the single most important choice a candidate makes didn't warrant more consideration and due diligence from John McCain.

What we know about Sarah Palin:

We know she describes herself "as pro-life as any candidate can get." We know -- Republican talking points aside -- that Palin supported the Bridge to Nowhere just two years ago, citing the need for action before her congressional delegation lost its political advantage. She sued to block protection of polar bears. And she's advocated for the teaching of creationism in public schools and campaigned hard for Pat Buchanan in 1996.

Susan Nielson did an excellent job this morning of laying out just how at odds Palin's politics are with the interests of the 18 million women who supported HIllary Clinton in the primary. But beyond any specific issue, I can think of few insults worse than the prospect of Sarah Palin, not Hillary Clinton, becoming the first woman president.

Prior to two days ago, if you asked 100 leaders in the Republican party to make a list of the top 100 people best prepared to serve as leader of the free world, Sarah Palin likely wouldn't have registered in the top 10,000.

America just got glimpse of the judgment we can expect from John McCain as president. And what we learned is that with McCain, the decision making of the next four years will look a lot like the gut decision disasters of the last eight. 

Update: An article in tomorrow's New York Times also highlights McCain's history of risky decision making. From the piece:

The selection was the culmination of a five-month process, described by Mr. McCain’s inner circle and outside advisers in interviews this past weekend, and offers a glimpse into how Mr. McCain might make high-stakes decisions as president. At the very least, the process reflects Mr. McCain’s history of making fast, instinctive and sometimes risky decisions. “I make them as quickly as I can, quicker than the other fellow, if I can,” Mr. McCain wrote, with his top adviser Mark Salter, in his 2002 book, “Worth the Fighting For.” “Often my haste is a mistake, but I live with the consequences without complaint.”
  • janek (unverified)
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    She's Pro-Life, but not if you're a moose, wolf, or polar bear.

  • Remulac (unverified)
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    What bugs me about McCain's choice of Sarah Palin is its shallowness. I rarely find myself agreeing with McCain on anything that doesn't also involve Russ Feingold, but he's never struck me as shallow. He cannot seriously believe that Sarah Palin possesses the education, training, and experience to take the helm in the more-than-unlikely event that McCain is (a) incapacitated by another bout of melanoma or (b), saints forefend, he should die in office. Nor can he seriously think that a President Palin would wish to continue his policies, given the multitude of points on which they disagree. A Dominionist creationist in charge of the United States (and it's storehouse of nuclear weapons)? Is that really the sort of politician "maverick" McCain would bequeath to us? A short-sighted decision, bounded entirely by electoral considerations, and most of them misguided.

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    I've been ruminating over this choice ever since McCain made it, and have written about it on my own blog. However, I didn't, until reading your post, internalize the idea that, after all of the hard work of feminists and their supporters, Sarah Palin could be the first woman president. Don't know why it didn't hit me, but now it really does. Clearly, it's more than just a possibility, given McCain's age ...

    Now I'm even more effing angry....

  • Bridget (unverified)
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    Is there any chance that the Republican delegates will pick somebody else for Veep?

    I almost cried when she stated in her acceptance speech "Oh gee whiz, I never planned on running for public office. I was just a hockey mom!"

    It reminded me of the apologies Anne Bradstreet wrote for her poems 200 years ago.

    I want a woman in the white house who says, "Hell yes, I ran for office, because I wanted to change things for the better."

    This country doesn't need a hockey mom for president. They need a leader, and there are plenty of republican women who could have fulfilled that role better than Sarah Palin.

    I know he didn't just pick her because she was a woman. There's that whole uber-conservative, pistol-packing, mother of 5 with a boy going to Iraq business. The female-ness is just icing on the cake. And shame on him for potentially putting our country in her inexperienced hands.

  • Rob (unverified)
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    What an absolute stupid post. Let's look at Obama and Bidens decision making and judgment shall we.

    First Obama's, lets see there is William Ayers, Rev. Wright, Tony Rezko and George Soros. A terrorist, a racist and a convicted fellon and a billionaire that wants to legalize drugs. These are the people he associates with and only tossed the first 3 under the bus after he was caught.

    Then there is Joe Biden. Remember his first run for Pres. He got busted for plagiarizing a speech from Neil Kinnock, then-leader of the British Labour Party. Something he was also caught doing in college. He has no original thoughts and needs to barrow others.

    Let's talk about Obama's Executive decision making abilities. Wait, we can't because there aren't any. The only thing he has ever run in his mouth. We can look at the 160 million he wasted with Terrorist Bill Ayers while they worked together on the Anneberg Foundation. Yes, Ayers was just some guy that lives in his neighborhood. Real good decision making on this one.

    Oh yea, you got some real winners there.

    As the Governor of Alaska she deals with Russia and Canada on a regular basis. The polar bear population is actually increasing (http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/05/080508132549.htm). She was right to protest.

    Wait, she thinks it is wrong to butcher an unborn child. I can see where the would bother you. Where as Obama does not want his child "to be punished with a baby," she brought a child into the world knowing it has Down's.

    I will take her judgment and decision making abilities over your two guys any day.

  • KTDM (unverified)
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    Hey Rob, So what do you Republican trolls get from McCain in gifts and prizes for hanging out on Democratic blogs and trying, in this case desperately, to defend the weakest choice for Vice President in recent history? By the way, can someone answer for me what it is about McCain that he does not appear to hang out with any women who aren't either swimsuit models (wife number 1), beauty queens (wife 2, VP) or cheerleaders (all of them, plus Vicki Iseman)? Hey Rob, how about the butchering of the Iraqi children this administration has managed so handily? Oh, and I feel so much better to know that we have someone as a potential VP who has experience dealing with CANADA. Not to mention the pressing issues related to the, um, Bering Strait w/Russia? I wonder if she's ever vacationed in Puerto Rica too!?!

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    Never mind bridging, bitch lied about being pregnant...

    http://mattdavisopenshismouth.com/2008/08/sarah-palin-lied-about-pregnancy/

  • Unrepentant Liberal (unverified)
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    She sounds like Marge Gunderson from "Fargo" don't ya know. Gonna be a heck-of-a-debate with that Joe Biden fellow.

  • Pedro (unverified)
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    Great post Charlie.

    Sarah Palin will be the punch line for many VP jokes for years to come.

    Elephant trolls like "Rob" are so confident that McBush picked a winner that instead of enjoying the long weekend they are hanging out on Blue Oregon trying to stop the laughter.

    Good luck to you "Rob"!

    It must really suck to be a Republican this year!

    • Pedro -
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    Rob is not defending Palin so much, KTDM. He's desperately trying to distract by attacking Obama. This is accomplished by pretending that people with whom he only has had a passing acquaintance is the equivalent of choosing them for Vice President of the United States. It's the typical Republican morality: lie, attack, lie, attack, make false comparisons, lie, attack, hope no one notices the billions of dollars they're stealing.

  • Rob (unverified)
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    Hey KTDM

    Glad to see you so eloquently defended you boys, not. I did 2 tours in Iraq. Sorry, we did not butcher any children. In fact, we went way out of the way to decrease collateral damage. But NObama does support the killing of 1.3 million children in the US. When it comes to answering a tough question he responds above his pay grade. A real winner ya got there, truly inspiring.

    You never did list NObamas executive experience.

    Hey KTDM, If you and you alone were responsible for the safety of 300 million people what would you do. Please be specific. Try your best to make me feel safe.

    Putin is laughing his ass off over your pick for a Pres.

    Again, why to defend your guy. You could have responded with "you mama wears army boots." Would have taken you less time to type and would have been just as intelligent a response.

    Time to go surf where the arguments are a little more challenging.

    And once again KDTM, go job at defending your guys. Go ahead and type what you want, I have no plans on coming back. No challenge here.

  • rob (unverified)
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    Sorry Steve saw your post as I was leaving. Please do list which statements I made that were a lie.

    I will let you off the hock, I am not coming back since you are unable to state specifics about my post.

    Oh and Steve, you did a heck of a job defending your weak candidate as well. Way to stand up and defend all his accomplishments. Wait, there aren't any.

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    "Go ahead and type what you want, I have no plans on coming back. No challenge here."

    NO! No more Rob? Oh, sob. sob. I miss him already.....

  • mlw (unverified)
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    Back under the bridge, troll! Back! Back!

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    Charlie makes an excellent point, which hasn't really been addressed by the comments so far.

    Whether you support or oppose Sarah Palin, whether you think she's qualified or not to be commander-in-chief, it sure does seem to say a lot about John McCain that he made the decision after meeting her just one time.

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    Some of our greatest Presidents had no executive experience before becoming President. Obama's elected office experience is very much like that of President Lincoln.

    Some of our worst Presidents (George W. Bush), for example, did have executive experience.

    The vast majority of the presidents that Americans have selected as the greatest presidents in fact did not serve in a position such as governor before becoming President. Many came out of Congress, cabinet positions, etc.

    Executive experience is not the most important quality of a Presidential candidate - I wouldn't even put it in my top 5. And apparently the majority of voters in this country don't have it as their top item either, as they nominated two people who have never held an elective office in the executive branch of our government. They chose Obama and McCain even when given the choice of those who did have such experience.

  • LT (unverified)
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    Listening to Springsteen sing Eyes on the Prize---remember that the goal is to win the election, not criticize the opposition. Don't get distracted.

    We SHALL Overcome if we just keep focused on the ultimate goal.

  • Mark Jaquette (unverified)
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    To quote OUIDA -

    "A cruel story runs on wheels, and every hand oils the wheels as they run.

  • Brian (unverified)
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    All this banter about weak VP choices and presidential succession got me ruminating over a similar hypothetical from days past. "The President of the United States, James Danforth Quayle!"

  • Unrepentant Liberal (unverified)
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    I don't think she lasts two weeks before resigning. The national spotlight will show her woefully unprepared for this task. She will be universally viewed as a colossal mistake on McCain's part. I think they will find too many skeletons in her closet. She reminds me of Thomas Eagleton.

    It was a huge mistake on McCain's part to even chose her because it plays up the issue of his age in a way Democrats wouldn't even try to: He's very, very old and not in great health. (I don't care what anybody says, he isn't) Her greatest job experience is as mayor of a small town.

    Imagine 'President Palin?" Facing the problems that we do, that should scare the s#[email protected] out of each and every American.

  • Jennifer (unverified)
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    Matt writes: "Bitch lied...." above...

    Every time you guys call her a bitch or talk about her vagina, you're costing Obama a few more votes.

    Misogynism looks worse when Democrats do it.

  • Bill R. (unverified)
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    Among friends I have in Alaska who have first hand knowledge of the trooper-gate scandal, their reaction is utter shock that McCain would have not vetted this choice, not even sent any staff to investigate. The trooper-gate story has real legs and involves, a blatantly unethical, and possibly illegal, abuse of power. The cover-up itself may doom her. She fired a respected civil servant,the Alaska State Commissioner of Public Safety, highly regarded among state troopers, for purposes of a personal vendetta against a former brother in law. The brother-in-law may be an ass-hole but following civil service rules he was placed under a probationary plan of correction for misconduct and has been in compliance.

    Palin has no sense of the boundaries between the personal and the public, and that is a fatal flaw in anyone aspiring to high office. Now McCain who met her once for a few minutes before choosing her, now calls her his "soul-mate." Sheesh... what a reckless judgment!

    Addendum: Memo to the McCain slime trolls- Why do you frequent this site and say provocative things? It's not like you're going to change any minds here. All you do is confirm the worst thoughts people have about your candidate and your party.

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    Memo to the McCain slime trolls- Why do you frequent this site and say provocative things? It's not like you're going to change any minds here. All you do is confirm the worst thoughts people have about your candidate and your party.

    Did you ever think mayber it's precisely because it is so easy to provoke you guys into elitist, misogynist, ignorant and hate-filled responses that we can then quote elsewhere as evidence of what the Democratic Party's true believers really think?

    The Sarah Palin issue is an excellent example of the obvious disdain so many of you feel for small towns, small states, small schools and the people who inhabit them. And the really amusing thing is that you think you can get away with this on your blogs because you somehow think that you are just talking to yourselves.

    And when we remind you that other people are listening in, you get worse! It just doesn't get any better than this.

  • KTDM (unverified)
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    We absolutely cannot underestimate the ability of Palin to galvanize the people we were hoping would stay home. It will be about all those guns, God, anti-abortion evangelicals and fundamentalists. They are ecstatic right now, and there are far too many of them in this country. They were seriously going to stay home, many of them, out of conscience, and now they are not. Every one of us needs to get out the vote. Every one of us has to work every bit as hard as we can. We cannot trust the slightly positive polls--they turn on a dime or one line misspoken. I've been getting emails from conservatives I know who are absolutely gleeful.

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    Jack Roberts wrote:

    Did you ever think maybe it's precisely because it is so easy to provoke you guys into elitist, misogynist, ignorant and hate-filled responses that we can then quote elsewhere as evidence of what the Democratic Party's true believers really think?

    Jack's right on here. While I enjoy reading and participating in these discussions, the frat-boy-like garbage into which threads frequently degenerate is idiotic. I respect people like Jack for engaging with us - and it should be easy enough to just ignore the real trolls. By responding to them in-kind you're doing the same thing that groups or protesters do when they're egged on to violence by provocateurs in ways that then completely undermine the purpose of the action, instead turning the focus onto the unruly tactics.

    How 'bout if, to borrow a phrase, folks think before they ink?

  • Steve (unverified)
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    Kari says "it sure does seem to say a lot about John McCain that he made the decision after meeting her just one time."

    Oh yeah it REALLY does seem to say a lot.

    Everything the left dreams up.

    Like this "I don't think she lasts two weeks before resigning. The national spotlight will show her woefully unprepared for this task. She will be universally viewed as a colossal mistake on McCain's part."

    Funny thing is the left found her universally colossal as soon as she was named.

    The immediate hatred for her seems to say a lot about the left.

  • Bill R. (unverified)
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    @ Jack Roberts says: "The Sarah Palin issue is an excellent example of the obvious disdain so many of you feel for small towns, small states, small schools and the people who inhabit them. And the really amusing thing is that you think you can get away with this on your blogs because you somehow think that you are just talking to yourselves."

    <hr/>

    Oh, great, Jack, the agent provocateur! Pretty juvenile. You have fallen pretty far in the political world, from holding state-wide office to being a slime troll in the blogosphere. I come from small town Oregon,born and raised, so I know something about small towns and low income voters,and a lot of small towns are waking up to what the Republican party has done for them. Maybe some of us in small towns can be fooled by the bumper stickers of "God, guns, and guts" for a while, but when Republicans ship our jobs overseas, and run us into the ditch of a low wage economy,destroy the family farm, turn the control of energy over to the oil companies, leave us without access to affordable health care, and try to divide America by race, creed, and sexual orientation to win elections, eventually it begins to sink in. Who are the real elitists in our country?

    Sarah Palin and her three homes, her big oil connections, doesn't represent the people of small towns. People in small towns don't believe in abuse of power for personal vendettas. People in small towns believe that every person should be able to take their children to a doctor and get adequate care. John McCain's health advisor says there are no uninsured in America because everyone can go to an emergency room. The health care crisis is even worse in rural Oregon thanks to your party.

    I know the extremist religious right loves Palin because she wants to criminalize abortion and some forms of birth control, she doesn't believe in science, and thinks the Bush/McCain war policies are just great, opposes universal health care coverage, and is owned by corporate interests, but she and the Republican party are the ones who are outside the mainstream. And you are supposed to be the "moderate" in the Repug party?? Troll away, Jack!

  • Pat Malach (unverified)
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    "The Sarah Palin issue is an excellent example of the obvious disdain so many of you feel for small towns, small states, small schools and the people who inhabit them."

    I don't think you put a whole lot of thought into that comment, jack.

    I come from a small town. I live in the mountains outside a small town. I love small towns. I just don't think being mayor of a small town for two years does much to prepare you to be VICE PRESIDENT of the United States.

    You're losing it, jack!

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    Palin thinks the Arctic is melting (as I write this, by the way) not because we are dumping billions of tons of CO2, methane, and other greenhouse gases into the atmosphere annually, but because it is part of a "natural cycle." She says she believes in science, but her statements (on creationism as well as global warming) belie her lack of acceptance of the work of thousands of scientists, who have spoken through the IPCC, as well as in Nature, Science, and many, many other peer reviewed venues. Unless you subscribe to an overwhelmingly comprehensive conspiracy theory, they cannot all be the subjects of a mind-control experiment by Al Gore.

    I don't care what she looks like, how popular she is in her home state, or who she appeals to among the conservative base. Can we afford to have someone so profoundly ignorant of what's going on in the real world be so close to leading our nation?

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    Almost forgot -

    I live in small town Oregon and have for nearly twenty years. I thought Jack Roberts lived in the Portland suburbs?

  • Remulac (unverified)
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    Hailing, as I do, from a small town in France, I have a special appreciation of the plight of little people everywhere.

    But seriously: it's a measure of the partisanship in political discourse nowadays that anyone can argue with a straight face that Sarah Palin is qualified to occupy the Oval Office [say it loud: President Sarah Palin] or that there is really any equivalency between the experience of Sarah Palin and Barack Obama. Reasonable people can agree, whether they agree with his policies or not, that John McCain has a great deal of experience. Same goes for Joe Lieberman, whom McCain would have chosen had not the state GOP heads staged a mini-rebellion to prevent a bi-partisan ticket.

    I disagree with both most of the time, but that hardly prevents me from acknowledging the wealth of expertise and insight they have amassed over the decades they have served in Congress. The fact that John McCain wanted Joe Lieberman as his running mate shows that he, too, is not so blinkered by partisanship (viz.: Jack Roberts) to recognize a wise head on the other side.

    The obvious corollary is that McCain is fully capable of recognizing inexperience and shallowness among the ranks of his own tribe. Confronted with the anti-Lieberman rebellion, did he simply shrug and give in to Rove? If McCain is so easily persuaded to make a frivolous decision, what does this predict about his presidency?

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    This woman is a brilliant pick. That's the genius of the next Karl Rove-- Steve Schmidt, McCain's cmapaign manager.

    Despite the big POW cushion, McCain is another spoiled brat who got special treatment from the time he entered school until the present, and has the same detatched sense of fuzzy privelege that we've come to admire in The Decider.

    <hr/>

    Two months ago, McCain was as good as gone, with his inept campaign, failure to stay on any message more than two seconds, new policy made just as it flew out of McCain's moouth having, once again, bypassed any chance to think things through. We were at, as Olbermann put it, "The candidate does not speak for the campaign."

    Enter Schmidt, and the candidate is out there doing simple repeitions of beleivable lies, has chosen a Veep on which an entire narrative can be manufactured and quickly hung.

    Schmidt and his Littler Tailors were busy fitting her up even before they told McCain who to pick.

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    If you think this didn't just make things a hella lot more difficult for our guys, you haven't paid attention for the past 30 years.

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    Sarah Palin as the first woman (vice) president would be the equivalent of Clarence Thomas as the first African-American Supreme Court justice--someone who benefited from the hard work and sacrifice of the liberal movement they refuse to recognize.

    I agree with Jenni Simonis on the experience canard--Lincoln had one whole term in the House under his belt when he assumed the presidency; Dan Quayle had been in the House/Senate for 12 years when George H. W. Bush tapped him for VP. So much for resumes. What matters more is the judgment and agenda of both the candidate and the party they represent.

    But I applaud McCain's honesty in his VP choice by finally coming clean as the far-right extremist that he is. This November's choices for America's future over the next four years should be crystal clear to all at this point.

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    Matt Singer, Enough with calling women bitches! What the hell is wrong with you?

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    Jack, you may be really excited about Sarah Palin, but what do you think about McCain's decision making process here and the fact the two apparently met only twice before his pick? Seems a little rash to me.

    It's also pretty ironic that McCain made this "maverick" pick because he didn't feel the religous right would let him get away with his first choice, Joe Lieberman. Not that I'm complaining about Lieberman's omission, but having social conservatives dictate the process doesn't strike me as very maverick-like.

    Democrats aren't against small states -- we plan on winning many of them in November. But I am enjoying watching the same party whose anti-Clinton mantra was "failed governor of a small state" try to now make this case.

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    Almost forgot -

    I live in small town Oregon and have for nearly twenty years. I thought Jack Roberts lived in the Portland suburbs?

    So Eugene is a Portland suburb now?

    I come from a small town. I live in the mountains outside a small town. I love small towns. I just don't think being mayor of a small town for two years does much to prepare you to be VICE PRESIDENT of the United States.

    But does that disqualify you from being Vice President? By the way, no one has explained why Howard Dean being governor of an even smaller state, Vermont, didn't disqualify him from running for President.

    Let's face it: If you guys really thought Sarah Palin was such a terrible pick, you wouldn't be wetting your collective pants over it.

    Actually, Obama, Biden and Hillary Clinton have been responding much more appropriately to this. As a Republican, I'm just thankful that you Democrats have as many vocal wackos as we do.

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    With all due respect, Mr. Roberts, Howard Dean was governor of Vermont for TWELVE years, not TWENTY months. Before that, he was Lieutenant Governor for two years.

    The other issue is that Howard Dean ran for President, and in those many months, was thoroughly vetted by the media and the public. Ms. Palin will be on the campaign trail for just over 60 days. Not much time for all of us to learn about her.

    And, to be fair, I wouldn't call her a "terrible" pick, I would call her a "surprisingly unqualified" pick, given the importance of the office she is being nominated to hold.

  • fbear (unverified)
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    Jack,

    Howard Dean was Governor of Vermont for over eleven years. Sarah Palin has been Governor of Alaska for less than two years, which means she has not had to govern based on the results of a previous legislative/budget cycle.

    She's also the governor of a state with a budget anomaly--Alaska's government is funded by oil revenues, so she hasn't had to deal with the budget wrangling and trade-offs that happen in most states.

    You're also ignoring the fact that it's not just her lack of experience, it's also things like the fact that she's said she's ignorant about Iraq. You'd think someone with a son about to be deployed there that she'd have looked into it a bit.

    I also wonder about the wisdom of a parent of a four-month-old special-needs child running for one of the top two offices in the land. Most of the parents I've known at that stage, men and women, found it challenging dealing with a regular 9 - 5 job.

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    I also wonder about the wisdom of a parent of a four-month-old special-needs child running for one of the top two offices in the land. Most of the parents I've known at that stage, men and women, found it challenging dealing with a regular 9 - 5 job.

    Please, please, make this an issue in this campaign.

    And don't forget to defend the state trooper who tasered his 11-year-old stepson while you're at it.

    Oh, and please also tell us what 12 years as a governor of small state teaches you about being President of the United States that 2 years doesn't teach you. Because that same argument would seem to apply to being a U.S. Senator for 3 years versus 21 years.

    Of course, we could settle all of this right now if we would all just agree that both John McCain and Joe Biden are qualified to be president, while Sarah Palin and Barack Obama are not.

  • Jennifer (unverified)
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    It was Matt Davis, not Matt Singer, who called the future Vice President a bitch.

    He's a "journalist" for the Portland Mercury. But he's not bitter, and loves to see women succeed.

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    Let's face it: If you guys really thought Sarah Palin was such a terrible pick, you wouldn't be wetting your collective pants over it.

    Actually, my pants are mostly dry, but there's a difference between whether someone is a "good" pick electorally and whether they'd do well behind the desk in the Oval Office.

    The scary thing (for me) is that I think this is might be a close election, despite what some people here see as an obvious advantage for Obama/Biden over McCain/Palin, and that the latter pair still have a chance of winning.

    As someone who was of the opinion that George W. Bush would make an incompetent president back in 2000, it gives me no great satisfaction to see someone like John McCain in the running for the White House, because I don't consider him competent, much less his running mate. And I think it's entirely possible that they could win.

  • Bob B (unverified)
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    That you don't agree with her politics should not be a suprise. And that doesn't make her less qualified. She's more qualified than the top of the Dem ticket. That her husband tried to get his mean drunk brother-in-law, who tasered his step son for fun, fired, will only endear Palin to most of the country. Keep underestimating her. The arrogance worked real well with Kerry and Gore.

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    Jack, if we agree that the vice presidency is important, I wonder if you think two meetings with Palin does this decision justice.

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    Mr. Roberts - Sarah Palin's decision to run for this office while she has a 4 month old infant with a genetic disability is, quite frankly, what causes me to be most concerned about her judgment. She is obviously pro-choice, and I commend her very personal decision to have her baby despite his genetic condition. Here's where I have a problem: she returned to work just THREE days after the delivery; she is taking on a very challenging campaign schedule with a four month old infant with a disability; her daughter, not she herself, held the infant during the announcement of Sarah's candidacy for Vice President. Makes me wonder if she is in denial about this infant, or uncomfortable about his disability, or just putting her own needs ahead of her family. Who is caring for the infant now? Has she bonded to him and if so, how can she leave him while she campaigns? Little Trig has very special needs and it does not appear that his pro-choice mother is demonstrating the appropriate attention to that detail. It makes her look pro-HER choice!

    For the sake of her baby, I hope I'm wrong.

  • mlw (unverified)
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    Please, people, Jack Roberts isn't a troll. Like all of us, some of his comments are more thoughtful, some less, but he never falls to the level of pure venom or vacuous propaganda that distinguishes a troll. Insults are never helpful.

    Sarah Palin is unqualified and deeply conservative in a way that doesn't jive with the beliefs of most Americans, but no one who has read much about her would call her dishonest, much less some of the less polite terms people have used. It is sufficient to simply tell the truth about her, not take her flaws to an illogical extreme. As Obama put it about about McCain, it's not that she doesn't care, it's just that she doesn't get it.

    Let's face it, although I deeply disagree with her positions, it would be reasonable to appoint her to Interior or Energy, since those positions match her background and aren't so important that you can't take some risks. However, putting her a heartbeat away from the Oval Office is too much of a risk. Of course, McCain has stated many times that he has no respect for the VP office anyway, so you might consider her nomination even more insulting.

    I like the analogy to Clarence Thomas. Like Palin, he was underqualified for his position and chosen entirely for his immutable identity, albeit race instead of gender. Like Thomas, her selection was apparently a deliberate insult to her highly qualified successor. I'm not a big Clinton fan, but I hope she doesn't have to go to her grave like Thurgood Marshall, watching her "successor" demolish everything that she's worked for her whole life.

  • genop (unverified)
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    How much experience did Obama have in presidential campaigning before he took on and beat the Clinton machine? The guy's a quick study and brilliant. Those qualities reflect fresh air after eight years of stale executive governance. A lifetime of experience means little to a slow learner. I'll take curiosity and intelligence over hubris and experience any day. McCain's choice for VP is consistent with preserving the status quo, while pushing for Gov't intervention in women's rights and resource depletion. A solid choice if that's what you want.

  • ginette mayas (unverified)
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    Stop the madness. I can still remember George H. Bush complaining about the "unfair pounding" leveled at his VP choice in 1988. Did he say something similar about Clarence Thomas? John McCain has spoken and in doing so has shuffled the deck. Let the new games begin and may the better man (Obama) prevail. John McCain knows what he is doing. I don't agree with candidate McCain 2008, but so be it. In the meantime even if this is a blog, please grow up. We are Americans, most of us civilized Americans. It is reprehensible to call the Governor of Alaska the "b" word (even though I am sure she would not flinch at leveling that word at another woman if the opportunity presented itself). Bill Clinton is absolutley right when he says the Constitution sets the criteria for president. In that respect Sarah Palin, McCain, Obama and the clerk at the supermarket (provided he or she is at least 35 years old and a US born citizen) are equally eligible to become president. The stakes are so high in this election. Democrats, right thinking Independents and progressive Repulicans must focus on the issues not the inevitable craziness of an election campaign.

    Respectfully,

    Working mother of toddler twins from Massachusetts

  • (Show?)

    Er, guys? She's done.

    http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/8/30/121350/137/486/580223

    http://bojack.org/2008/08/clip_and_save.html

  • (Show?)

    I also have twins, am the mother of five and worked while raising my family. My questions about Ms. Palin's choice to run for the second highest office in America AT THIS POINT IN TIME and in light of her situation, I feel, are legitimate. I am not calling her names, I am not belittling her, I am simply questioning her decision. As a Mom, I feel I am entitled to ask these questions - and so are other Moms. We will not all agree on the answer.

  • Ed Bickford (unverified)
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    The qualifications for the offices of President or Vice President is laid out in the Constitution:

    "No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States." (Article 2, Sec. 1) "But no person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States." (Amendment 12)

    Those are the qualifications in full, other than convincing the actual people of the United States that the candidate will properly represent the will of those people in accordance with their Constitution. So the bankruptcy of any shouts of lack of qualifications of either of slates of candidates is exposed.

    The truth is that we need to know well the character and philosophy of government of the nominees; that cannot be learned by the electorate in two short, busy months. It becomes more acutely necessary to know the Vice Presidential nominee who is running as back-up to a man in his seventies.

    What raises the ire of myself and many others on this blog is the sheer cynicism behind the choice of an unknown woman for VP, which seems merely aimed to exploit a perceived discontent with the loss of the nomination by Hillary Clinton. Their assumption that the lack of any presence on the national political scene by their nominee should be of no concern to the electorate is insult added to injury.

  • (Show?)

    Jack, that's not going to kill her candidacy, if it's true (and the photos certainly look convincing) it'll get played as a private family matter. And it kind of blows any concerns about her needing to stay home to take care of the newborn out of the water.

  • Why Not A Mom? (unverified)
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    I find the criticism of Mrs. Palin being a working Mom curious from many on the left on the various blogs out there. It's not up to us to question the choices of another woman or family. Question OUR own choices, sure, but we should not pick her a part because she is a woman who wants to work. Many day to day average working Moms have to leave their babies to return to work. It's reality for so many. Further, there are many other Moms who return to work because they WANT to work, want careers, and be their own person. Don't we embrace women in the workplace? Don't we respect women who want positions of earning potential and influence? Didn't we give them (us!) equal rights? Since when are we picking on women because we might actually want to have a kick ass career AND have a uterus?

    Yes, she's got a disabled child. And? So, she's supposed to not work anymore? She has a husband who apparently is quite involved with the kids, much more than many Dads seem to be. Seems like she can trust her husband to do a parent's job, while she brings home the bacon. This is an alternative family, and so what? Good for her! Don't we support this?

    If we don't like her because of her positions on things like guns and abortion, fine by me. But to pick on her because she has kids and a child with special needs, and wants to work in a position of power....hmmmm, I think we've not gotten anywhere in the women's movement then, have we?

    This is hard to verbalize, and I am saddened by many of the comments I've been reading about how she should just be a Mommy and stay out of the White House. Like her politics or not, the opportunity SHE has is what we have fought so hard for. She's got her "balls on the line" in a sexist world and we are picking on her for it. Shame on us all.

  • Ed Bickford (unverified)
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    Shame on you WNAM for trivializing the selection for the back-up to a 70-year-old candidate for President! Ms. Palin is not unsuited for high office because she is (reputedly) the mother of a young child.

  • Harry Kershner (unverified)
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    Jack Roberts said, "Of course, we could settle all of this right now if we would all just agree that both John McCain and Joe Biden are qualified to be president, while Sarah Palin and Barack Obama are not."

    McCain, Obama, Biden and Palin are all unqualified corporatist hacks. None of them represent change from the brutal, thuggish foreign policy, or the insane economic and environmental policies that threaten our very existence. Maybe we deserve them. (I hope not.)

  • (Show?)

    Oops! Thank you Jennifer, I don't know why my eyes read it wrong. So, what the hell is wrong with you Matt Davis? Haha.

  • Why Not A Mom? (unverified)
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    She likey is NOT suited due to about 1,000 other reasons other than having a working uterus. But, there is an undertone in so many "anti Palin" postings that it's because she is a woman with a disabled child. There are also BLATANT comments that she should not be the candidate because she is a Mom. That's what I am sayin'.

    Good for her for getting where she is, still.

  • (Show?)

    Jack,

    While I respect your service in public office and would not criticize you personally, I was hoping you would respond to the substance of my comments. Or are you saying that McCain is an environmental wacko for acknowledging that global warming is a serious problem that we need to deal with?

  • Ed Bickford (unverified)
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    WNAM, you are wasting your time fighting with trolls that bloviate that women should be barefoot and pregnant, not in the halls o' gummit, dang-nabit! Where are you going to get with them? Getting Gov. Palin where she is now is not a good thing, for herself or women in general! She is being set up as a prop for a seriously cynical campaign that is only using her identity as woman for their political gamesmanship. If they were serious about putting up a woman for high office, what in the name of all that is holy would they go with this unknown one?

  • LT (unverified)
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    "Matt Singer, Enough with calling women bitches! What the hell is wrong with you?"

    He recalls what Barbara Bush called Geraldine F. perhaps?

  • LT (unverified)
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    Jack, when I say Sarah Palin reminds me of Sara Gelser, am I showing disdain for small towns? They are both very bright young women. And the last time I checked, women as individuals have the right to decide which of those women they believe makes the most sense, says things they agree with.

    For the rest of you, be aware that there are intelligent people who don't always pay attention to news, esp. on a holiday weekend. Like the conversation I overheard on Sunday among two women very involved with family and community who hadn't yet heard that McCain had chosen a VP.

    Folks, let's set an example by treating Sarah Palin better than Republicans treated Geraldine Ferraro. Keep it to the issues.

    For example, "Gov.Palin, both Alaska US Senators voted for the GI Bill. Sen. McCain was not there for the vote. Do you agree with McCain's lack of support for that bill?"

    OR "Gov. Palin, Sen. Biden is very proud of his work on the Violence Against Women Act. Sen. McCain seems to oppose some or all of it. Can you understand there are women more likely to support the Democratic ticket on that issue alone?"

    Either she has good responses to such questions (sure to be asked of her in the next couple months by reporters, in town hall meetings, in debates/ joint appearances) or she doesn't. Potshots on blogs (one way or another) will not change the impression (whatever it may be) left by how she answers questions. Remember, it may well be that different people will answer such questions differently.

    And Jack, I hear that before the 2004 election there was some kind of Republican call center in Oregon (Portland?) where people who couldn't find work elsewhere worked the phones for a little over min. wage--not because they were Republican activists but because they needed to earn a living. Just happened to hear that--and hear how many of the people there wouldn't have voted Republican, but they needed a job and happened to land that one.

    Republicans might want to think about such low wage workers the next time they move to cut government services so they can brag "at least we didn't raise your taxes". Of the Oregonians who make less than $10 per hour (many of those folks work part time, on call, temp., uncertain hours), how many of those folks got tax cuts in the last 10 years? You do realize that they each have one vote apiece, just like the folks who qualified for every Bush tax cut, don't you?

    Do you realize that although Zupancic won that Congressional Primary, St. Sen. Winters is a hero to many in Marion County for voting for that tax increase to pay for the services she refused to cut as a W & M subcommittee chair? Zupancic didn't carry Marion County in either the primary or the general, and there were Republicans who never had a positive impression of the Zupancic or the sort of campaign he waged.
    There are conversations which go on among ordinary folks where one person says "Republicans only care about rich people" and someone else may say, "The party is like that, but there are some admirable individual Republicans". Such folks sometimes say, "I never voted for Jackie, but she is much admired for the stand she took on Ways and Means saying there were cuts so severe she would not allow them to leave her committee".

    One estimate says the real swing voters in this election are not women or minorities but such voters--the folks who would consider themselves lucky to earn over $10 per hour.

    There are folks who vote on the basis of how they rank candidates on that famous poll question, "Cares about people like me, understands my problems, will make my life better".

  • Douglas K (unverified)
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    And don't forget to defend the state trooper who tasered his 11-year-old stepson while you're at it.

    Jack, nobody here has defended the trooper, and you know it. I haven't seen anyone on any site defend the trooper thus far. The issue here is whether Governor Palin abused the power of her office in trying to get him fired for personal reasons instead of following due process, and you know it. Your stance here is every bit as dishonest as all the folks in your party who pretended that criticizing Bush's unprovoked invasion of Iraq was the same as defending the ghastly reign of Saddam Hussein. Changing the subject to avoid talking about wrongdoing by a member of your party.

    Given your public record and your comments on Blue Oregon in the past, I know you're smarter than that. Up until now, I assumed you were more principled as well.

    Also:

    Let's face it: If you guys really thought Sarah Palin was such a terrible pick, you wouldn't be wetting your collective pants over it.

    "Wetting our pants" with laughter, maybe. If you genuinely believed anybody here was nervous about Palin, it wouldn't say much for your reading comprehension. But I think you're only pretending to misunderstand the reaction over here.

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    Jack,

    While I respect your service in public office and would not criticize you personally, I was hoping you would respond to the substance of my comments. Or are you saying that McCain is an environmental wacko for acknowledging that global warming is a serious problem that we need to deal with?

    No, I tend to agree with McCain on global warming (although I'm not convinced "cap and trade" is a realistic way to deal with it). And I'm still a pro-choice Republican who disagrees with Palin (and McCain) on a number of issues.

    I just find many of the attacks on Gov. Palin to be over the top and believe they reveal a blindspot among many (certainly not all) Democrats as to why they have so much trouble with rural, middle class and, yes, much of working class America.

  • Ladies Home Journal (unverified)
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    Sarah Palin is unqualified and deeply conservative in a way that doesn't jive with the beliefs of most [delete "Americans"] BlueOregon commenters.

    FTFY...

  • Luke (unverified)
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    McCain = Tons of legislative experience. Biden = Tons of legislative experience. Palin = Some executive experience. Obama = Some legislative experience.

    Since executive experience > legislative experience, we can conclude that:

    McCain and Biden have similar experience, followed by Palin, and with Obama taking up the rear.

    It'd be at least a somewhat comparible ticket of it was Biden/Obama vs. McCain/Palin...

    Wait... why is Obama running for President again?

  • Mark (unverified)
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    NOW i know why this site is called BLUEoregon!!!!

  • LT (unverified)
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    Jack, really now: "why they have so much trouble with rural, middle class and, yes, much of working class America."

    You do realize how close Peralta and Gilbertson came to winning legislative elections in rural areas, don't you ?(perhaps Future Pac made mistakes, but broadbrushing all Democrats ???)

    There are people in rural areas, middle class and working class Americans who depend on a variety of government services. There are Republicans like Jackie Winters who understand that. There are Republicans who think "we won't raise your taxes, don't ask how we intend to pay for that promise" is all we need to know about them.

    You do know Sherrod Brown was elected to the US Senate from Ohio, Jim Webb from Virginia, and others from similar states, regardless of what Republicans like you say about Democratic failings, don't you?

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    Luke,

    Presidents don't need legislative experience. Of the Executive Dynamic Duo it's the Veep who needs legislative experience.

    Biden = LOTS of legislative experience. Palin = 0

    Let's talk experience and knowledge that a President actually does need to know a thing or two about: Constitutional law.

    Obama = 12 years teaching Constitutional law at a school famous for spawning federal judges. McCain = 0

  • Harry Kershner (unverified)
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    I share Jack Roberts' skepticism re "cap and trade". Nader/Gonzalez is in favor of a straight-out tax on hydrocarbon production at the production source as opposed to a credit exchange, which can be easily manipulated (Carbon Tax).

    I also agree with Jack that DP leadership holds an essentially elitist attitude toward ordinary people, although I find the prospect of Palin in the presidency to be equally horrifying to that of Joe Biden.

  • Remulac (unverified)
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    Jack Roberts repeats an urban myth that Barack Obama and the Democrats somehow don't appeal to working class Americans. The real problem is that there is little evidence to support the myth. On the contrary, the most recent polling data show that Barack Obama leads John McCain among working class Americans in general, and even among working class whites in particular. Overall, low-wage workers prefer Obama over McCain by a two to one margin. And that's not all: to quote an August 4 report in the Washington Post:

    [E]ven among white workers -- a group of voters that has been targeted by both parties as a key to victory in November -- Obama leads McCain by 10 percentage points, 47 percent to 37 percent, and has the advantage as the more empathetic candidate.

    The main reason, according to the same poll, is that Obama offers working class Americans something that John McCain does not: hope that they will get access to affordable healthcare. It is for working class Americans quite literally a matter of life-or-death importance.

    There are many reasons why the GOP is in the ditch right now, and not all of them are bound up with Dubya's reckless adventure in Iraq.

  • (Show?)

    I also agree with Jack that DP leadership holds an essentially elitist attitude toward ordinary people, although I find the prospect of Palin in the presidency to be equally horrifying to that of Joe Biden.

    I find it curious that those who love/admire education, embrace hard work and working families, demand access to adequate health care, want fiscal responsibility and an end to the war in Iraq/peace and a government that competently represents its citizenry to be negative, aka "elitist".

    Color me elitist, then. I'll wear it proudly. From what I've seen since 1994--Republican/conservative "leadership" is an absolute mess. I'll take "elitist" over that any day (and twice on Sunday.)

  • (Show?)

    I also agree with Jack that DP leadership holds an essentially elitist attitude toward ordinary people...

    I always find comments like this so funny since many of those in DP leadership are just "ordinary" people.

  • Luke (unverified)
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    It's funny that you think teaching law qualifies one to be president--because I'm currently a law student right now, and I can tell you that law professors are probably in a tie with country western banjo players as far as presidential qualities...

  • (Show?)

    Luke,

    You have my condolenscences on your inability to get into a reputable law school.

    Good luck with the bar exam. From your own account it's clear that you'll need it.

  • (Show?)

    Seem almost incredible to me that this conversation continued without a huccup and only a single acknowledgement of Jack Bog's posting a link to photographic evidence that Palin was not apparently pregnant at any time during her alleged pregnancy, but her sixteen year old daughter was.

    This is not a Left/Right discussion. It is an Affirmation/Information discussion, and affirmation over information is pretty much always the lowest common denominator of conversation.

  • (Show?)

    I actually agree, Pat. Over on my blog I put up a quick blurb about it and gave a hat tip to Jack for bringing it to my attention. But I kept expecting to see somebody from Admin put up a post on it here.

    :::shrugs:::

  • Douglas K (unverified)
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    The whole "Palin is raising her daughter's child" story is based on inference drawn from ambiguous facts. It could very easily be shot down tomorrow if Palin simply released the medical records of her own pregnancy. And BTW, a photograph of a girl with a slightly pudgy stomach doesn't prove "pregnancy." it might just be the girl's normal distribution of body fat.

    The "story" is pure gossip -- and gossip at the expense of a sixteen year old girl, at that -- and doesn't deserve repetition or comment unless and until there's something more substantive behind it.

  • Steve (unverified)
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    If and when Palin becomes President she will have at least a few years as Vice Presidnet on top of being a governor, at which time she'll be far more qualified than Barak is now. Furthermore it will be the Republican Party to have delivered a woman to the white house.

    Now doesn't that just make you blues sick?

  • (Show?)

    Welp Doug, you and I looked at a different sent of photos on the same link then.

    I'm not arguing that the photos I saw of both mother and daughter and the accompanying text is conclusive, but a month ago, when I saw the photos of John Edwards, doting father in a hotel room, I saw a similar affirmation of the facts.

    Facts that were very inconvenient to me, and indeed I fervently wished were untrue.

    Nevertheless, I am awill always be, about information, as the people who's resepect I covet are all about facts and not at all about wishes.

    The basic rationalist position is:

    Find the simplest answer that fits all of the evidence that you currently have available, and that becomes your working theory until additional facts come to light that either affirm your position or require you to change your theory.

    What you want is totally irrelevant. It's always all about what is.

  • Luke (unverified)
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    No need to be rude Kevin. I know where are at least a few people at blueoregon that would frown on such behavior.

  • Luke (unverified)
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    *there

  • Pedro (unverified)
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    Search Google News for: "Trig Palin" + Bristol then sort by date.

    The cover up is under way. The name of the doctor who reportedly delivered the baby has been removed from the medical center web site. The doctor is a close friend of VP designate Sarah Palin. Ms. Palin has appointed that doctor to a State medical commission. Pictures on the official Alaska State website of Governor Palin during the last two months of her purported pregnancy have been moved three times since McCain selected her. On the last version of the website they disappeared entirely.

    dailykos is on it!

    It sure must suck to be an elephant this year!

    • Pedro -
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    I'd be cautious about citing Daily Kos on this. See: Palin's Baby? Let the Enquirer Figure It Out.

  • (Show?)

    That poor girl. Whether she was pregnant or not, how horrible for a teenage girl? America trying to figure out whether or not she was pregnant based on some pictures of her stomach? I just can't imagine.

  • Pedro (unverified)
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    Point well taken Dan

    • Pedro -
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    The "story" is pure gossip -- and gossip at the expense of a sixteen year old girl, at that -- and doesn't deserve repetition or comment unless and until there's something more substantive behind it.

    It doesn't deserve repetition no matter what the substance. It's none of our business, period.

  • Bill Bodden (unverified)
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    McCain: “Often my haste is a mistake, but I live with the consequences without complaint.”

    Unfortunately, others died and were maimed for life when McCain made a mistake voting for the war on Iraq, and who knows how many more will experience similar fates from a President McCain's mistakes?

  • llywrch (unverified)
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    Well, the story about Palin raising her daughter's baby as her own may not be true. (I find the matter, while not fatal to her hopes, doesn't help her in the least.) However, this incident during her tenure as mayor of Wasilla is clearly damaging. Based on that incident & the later Troopergate incident, she is a vindictive --er, I don't want to use language that would lose the Democrats the votes of any more women.

    Sheesh, didn't anyone learn anything from the Eagleton incident? Only an incompetent would fail to vet a likely nominee!

    Geoff

  • johnnie (unverified)
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    Wow. Citing the DailyKos for you news? Yikes it's worse than I thought here in SadOregon.

    She's done more in 20 months than Obama did in 4 years and has done more in her short career than old man Biden did in 35 years being a blow-hard in the US Senate.

    She's taken on her own party, helped bring Stevens to justice, had a kid (yes it's hers you kooks), took on Big Oil lobbyist, renegotiated oil revenue to the citizen's, got all she wanted from negotiating a new pipeline, the list goes on and on...

    Her pet peeve is politicians who has kids who are lobbyist (to lobby their dads). Biden and Ried better watch out. Having your kids lobby you for pet project's, campaign contributions and hundred's of thousands in "salary" will soon become unethical. It's already immoral.

    I love the Obama ad about the Veep pick, pre-made, showing Palin's picture without nameing her saying her pick is "more of the same." What a maroon. I thought Obama was "scary smart". He must have voted 'present' when deciding to air that ad.

    I do have reservations with a Palin, Biden debate. She'll beat Biden so badly Joe may get the sympathy vote. That's ok - the American people will understand the they'd rather have a person with real judgement one heart beat away than a person who votes present all the time in the President's office or someone who is experienced at being wrong all the time as Biden has been during the Regan years, voting against the Oil Pipeline, against the Gulf War, voting for the Iraq war, voting to stop funding the troops, and voting for the Bridge to nowhere.

    Here's some REAL site's to see:

    http://surberpictures.blogspot.com/2008/08/caribou.html

    http://www.newsminer.com/news/2008/jul/28/scrutiny-wooten-raises-conduct-questions/

    http://community.adn.com/node/118874

    Boy she sure fakes being pregnant very well. Don't worry the DailyKooks are on it! Funny and yet so sad a small segment of our population is so petty they'd make up and believe such lies.

  • johnnie (unverified)
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    llywrch - You are kidding right?

    If Clinton can survive troopergate then Palin can survive a wannebe LA cop threatening relatives and tasering a 10 year old! His excuse? The 10 year old said it was ok!

    How many 10 year old does Wooten have to taser before you'd defend Palin over him?

    http://www.newsminer.com/news/2008/jul/28/scrutiny-wooten-raises-conduct-questions/

    The conduct from the Kooky left will do more damage to domestic violence groups and women's groups soley to put Obama in office.

    Domestic Violence is no joke and shouldn't be condoned just because you are of a different party Palin.

    SadOregon has degenerated into a angry, hate filled group of kooks. Kari - sad to see your site get so freaked out by a woman who walks the walk and talks the talk. I thought people here hated corrupt R's and wanted to purge them. Should she have just played along?

  • (Show?)

    "Every time you guys call her a bitch or talk about her vagina, you're costing Obama a few more votes."

    Link? In any case, I hear an awful lot of women are insulted, precisely because in their view her vagina figured overwhelmingly in the choise.

    And while ordinarily I might agree, not for Sarah Palin, who sat and giggled on air recently, while a morning show host literally called the state Senate leader a bitch during their interview. This guy ranted on and on, and Palin just laughed and played along. If she thinks it's funny, then fuck her, let her deal with it.

  • Kevin (unverified)
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    Guys - I'm not going to post the links for you...but there are picture out there of a very pregnant Palin. Daily backed off of this. If they backed off you KNOW they messed up.

  • Kevin (unverified)
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    lol - the Daily screwed up so badly they are saying it's possible this is a Rove deal. "If you really stop and think about this, it has all the signs of a Karl Rove head fake."

  • johnnie (unverified)
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    Kooky Kevin - Why is every screw-up the Kooky left participates in (which everything), ends up being Rove's fault. Why not admit that you are just wrong?

  • johnnie (unverified)
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    Kooky Kevin - Why is every screw-up the Kooky left participates in (which everything), ends up being Rove's fault. Why not admit that you are just wrong?

  • Kevin (unverified)
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    Here you go you animals:

    http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/8/31/234157/516/1017/581734

    Can the adults proceed now?

  • Kevin (unverified)
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    Dear Johnnie- I was pointing out what the left (Daily) is now saying (that it could be a Rove setup) about their "scandalous Palin" story.

  • (Show?)

    NOTE COMMENT BROKEN INTO MANY BECAUSE OF TYPEPAD'S BRAINDAMAGED ANTI-SPAM FILTER

    rob: Sorry Steve saw your post as I was leaving. Please do list which statements I made that were a lie. ... Way to stand up and defend all his accomplishments. Wait, there aren't any.

    How can I respond about your lies, when you keep making them?

    Really, you're not worth my time. However, for the benefit of everyone else, here is a brief run down of the accomplishments you deliberately pretend Barack Obama doesn't have:

    On the Death Penalty:

    While an Illinois state senator, Obama was key in getting the state's notorious death penalty laws changed, including a requirement that in most cases police interrogations involving capital crimes must be recorded.

    The changes enacted in 2003 reformed a system that had sent 13 people to death row, only to have them released because they were later determine to be innocent or had been convicted using improper methods.

  • (Show?)

    [correction to above link -- TYPEPAD coders are clearly underqualified] On the Death Penalty

  • (Show?)

    [comment continuation]

    On health care for poor children

    As a state senator, Barack Obama sponsored and helped pass legislation that expanded and made permanent Illinois' KidCare program by raising eligibility from 185% to 200% of the federal poverty level. The legislation provided coverage for an additional 20,000 children and 65,000 more Illinois adults in the first year, and by 2007 had expanded health care to 70,000 kids and 84,000 adults. In its endorsement for his Senate race, the State Journal--Register wrote, "Obama brings similar common--sense views to improving health care in America -- for example, as a state senator he championed the successful KidCare program that assists thousands of children of the working poor."

  • (Show?)

    [comment continuation]

    A graph of Obama's prolific state bill sponsorship.

    On his major lobbying reform bill: Stated the Washington Post wrote in an editorial,

    "The final package is the strongest ethics legislation to emerge from Congress yet...Mr. Reid, along with Sens. Russell Feingold (D--Wis.) and Barack Obama (D--Ill.), deserves credit for assembling and passing this package."

  • (Show?)

    On his work with Senator Colburn (R-OK) in requiring a database of federal spending.

    U.S. Senators Tom Coburn (R-OK) and Barack Obama (D-IL) today hailed the Senate’s passage of the “Federal Funding Accountability and Transparency Act,” a bill that will create a Google-like search engine and database to track approximately $1 trillion in federal grants, contracts, earmarks and loans. ... More than 100 organizations ranging from Americans for Prosperity and Taxpayers for Common Sense to the National Gay and Lesbian Task Force and Greenpeace have endorsed S. 2590.

    Dozens of editorials boards across the country including the Wall Street Journal, Los Angeles Times, Washington Post, Chicago Sun-Times and The Oklahoman have also endorsed S. 2590.

    On his work with Senator Lugar (R-IN) to greatly expand destruction of foreign weapons under the "Cooperative Proliferation Detection, and Interdiction Assistance and Conventional Threat Reduction Act"

    [Lugar] said that the program has expanded from an original focus on securing and destroying nuclear weapons stockpile of the former Soviet Union to include "all types of nuclear, chemical, and biological weapons and materials, as well as employing former weapons scientists."

  • (Show?)

    [omitting the rest of the links for brevity]

    He sponsored a bill to promote democracy in the Congo, signed into law by President Bush. He also sponsored other legislation to create an independent “Office of Public Integrity” that would investigate congressional ethics cases and receive and monitor financial disclosure reports required from members of Congress, officers and employees of Congress and lobbyists. This didn't pass, though it should have.

    ...

    Normally, rob, I'd give you the benefit of the doubt, and merely accuse you of being, as is typical for most hard right wingers, stupid. But since you seem to be able to look up smears on right wing websites, I figure you can use google as well. So your misstatements about Barack Obama "not having any" experience are clearly deliberate. In other words, you lie.

  • Gregor (unverified)
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    I went through the 100 posts here and I have to agree we need to lay off the B word when talking about her. It's pure sexism, nothing less.

    Let's stick to the facts that are sufficent for any of us, the elitist, lefties. Frankly, anyone who holds creationism as truth is delusional, IMHO. So, if there are sufficent people of that variety of faith in this country, McCain made a smart choice. But if, and I pray this is true, there are sufficent remaining rational voters, aka elitists, then Obama is the man. I will maintain my audacity until results prove otherwise.

    PS - Question to those who support the small arms industry, why is this woman pointing a gun at a cameraman with her finger anywhere near the trigger?!?!? My mentor told me you NEVER point a gun at anyone for any reason even if you know it is not loaded. It is just something you NEVER EVER DO ... EVER. 100 posts later and I cannot get the picture out of my head.

  • Unrepentant Liberal (unverified)
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    Mayor or a town of 6,000 = "Executive Experience." In a town that size, it was her turn to be Mayor."Hey, Wally did it last year, you're up."

    She's incredibly unqualified. Please don't insult us by claiming otherwise.

  • Bob B (unverified)
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    Mayor or a town of 6,000 = "Executive Experience."

    If she's as inexperienced as all that, why do you pretend she was only Mayor and not Governor? Is that supposed to make your point stronger? Is no one suppose to notice that? Is is because Alaska's population is similar to Delaware's?

  • Bob B (unverified)
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    This is not a slight. I really want to know. Did Obama actually author any legislation? Did any of it make its way out of Congress?

  • johnnie (unverified)
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    Good comparison of Palin vs. Obama. As anyone can see Obama << Palin

    Political experience

    Obama: Worked his way to the top by cultivating, pandering to and stroking the most powerful interest groups in the all-pervasive Chicago political machine, ensuring his views were aligned with the power brokers there.

    Palin: Worked her way to the top by challenging, attacking and actively undermining the Republican party establishment in her native Alaska. She ran against incumbent Republicans as a candidate willing and able to clean the Augean Stables of her state's government.

    Political Biography

    Obama: A classic, if unusually talented, greasy-pole climber. Held a succession of jobs that constitute the standard route to the top in his party's internal politics: "community organizer", law professor, state senator.

    Palin:A woman with a wide range of interests in a well-variegated life. Held a succession of jobs - sports journalist, commercial fisherwoman, state oil and gas commissioner, before entering local politics. A resume that suggests something other than burning political ambition from the cradle but rather the sort of experience that enables her to understand the concerns of most Americans..

    Political history

    Obama: Elected to statewide office only after a disastrous first run for a congressional seat and after his Republican opponent was exposed in a sexual scandal. Won seat eventually in contest against a candidate who didn't even live in the state.

    Palin: Elected to statewide office by challenging a long-serving Republican incumbent governor despite intense opposition from the party.

    Appeal

    Obama: A very attractive speaker whose celebrity has been compared to that of Britney Spears and who sends thrills up Chris Matthews' leg

    Palin: A very attractive woman, much better-looking than Britney Spears who speaks rather well too.

    Executive experience

    Obama: Makes executive decisions every day that affect the lives of his campaign staff and a vast crowd of traveling journalists

    Palin:Makes executive decisions every day that affect the lives of 500,000 people in her state, and that impact crucial issues of national economic interest such as the supply and cost of energy to the United States.

    Religious influences

    Obama: Regards people who "cling" to religion and guns as "bitter" . Spent 20 years being mentored and led spiritually by a man who proclaimed "God damn America" from his pulpit. Mysteriously, this mentor completely disappeared from public sight about four months ago.

    Palin: Head of her high school Fellowship of Christian Athletes and for many years a member of the Assemblies of God congregation whose preachers have never been known to accuse the United States of deliberately spreading the AIDS virus. They remain in full public sight and can be seen every Sunday in churches across Alaska. A proud gun owner who has been known to cling only to the carcasses of dead caribou felled by her own aim.

    Record of bipartisan achievement

    Obama: Speaks movingly of the bipartisanship needed to end the destructive politics of "Red America" and "Blue America", but votes in the Senate as a down-the-line Democrat, with one of the most liberal voting records in congress.

    Palin: Ridiculed by liberals such as John Kerry as a crazed, barely human, Dick Cheney-type conservative but worked wit Democrats in the state legislature to secure landmark anti-corruption legislation.

    Former state Rep. Ethan Berkowitz - a Democrat - said. "Gov. Palin has made her name fighting corruption within her own party, and I was honored when she stepped across party lines and asked me to co-author her ethics white paper."

    On Human Life

    Obama: Devoutly pro-choice. Voted against a bill in the Illinois state senate that would have required doctors to save the lives of babies who survived abortion procedures. The implication of this position is that babies born prematurely during abortions would be left alone, unnourished and unmedicated, until they died.

    Palin: Devoutly pro-life. Exercised the choice proclaimed by liberals to bring to full term a baby that had been diagnosed in utero with Down Syndrome.

    Now it's true there are other crucial differences. Sen Obama has appeared on Meet The Press every other week for the last four years. He has been the subject of hundreds of adoring articles in papers and newsweeklies and TV shows and has written two Emmy-award winning books.

    Gov Palin has never appeared on Meet the Press, never been on the cover of Newsweek. She presumably feels that, as a mother of five children married to a snowmobile champion, who also happens to be the first woman and the youngest person ever to be elected governor of her state, she has not really done enough yet to merit an autobiography.

    Then again, I'm willing to bet that if she had authored The Grapes of Wrath, sung like Edith Piaf and composed La Traviata , she still wouldn't have won an Emmy.

    Fortunately, it will be up to the American people and not their self-appointed leaders in Hollywood and New York to determine who really has the better experience to be president.

    Gerard Baker is US Editor and Assistant Editor of The Times of London. Email: [email protected]

  • johnnie (unverified)
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    Obama < Palin

    Good synopsis of the bottom of the R ticket versus the TOP of the Dem ticket.

    <hr/>

    Political experience

    Obama: Worked his way to the top by cultivating, pandering to and stroking the most powerful interest groups in the all-pervasive Chicago political machine, ensuring his views were aligned with the power brokers there.

    Palin: Worked her way to the top by challenging, attacking and actively undermining the Republican party establishment in her native Alaska. She ran against incumbent Republicans as a candidate willing and able to clean the Augean Stables of her state's government.

    Political Biography

    Obama: A classic, if unusually talented, greasy-pole climber. Held a succession of jobs that constitute the standard route to the top in his party's internal politics: "community organizer", law professor, state senator.

    Palin:A woman with a wide range of interests in a well-variegated life. Held a succession of jobs - sports journalist, commercial fisherwoman, state oil and gas commissioner, before entering local politics. A resume that suggests something other than burning political ambition from the cradle but rather the sort of experience that enables her to understand the concerns of most Americans..

    Political history

    Obama: Elected to statewide office only after a disastrous first run for a congressional seat and after his Republican opponent was exposed in a sexual scandal. Won seat eventually in contest against a candidate who didn't even live in the state.

    Palin: Elected to statewide office by challenging a long-serving Republican incumbent governor despite intense opposition from the party.

    Appeal

    Obama: A very attractive speaker whose celebrity has been compared to that of Britney Spears and who sends thrills up Chris Matthews' leg

    Palin: A very attractive woman, much better-looking than Britney Spears who speaks rather well too. .

    Executive experience

    Obama: Makes executive decisions every day that affect the lives of his campaign staff and a vast crowd of traveling journalists

    Palin:Makes executive decisions every day that affect the lives of 500,000 people in her state, and that impact crucial issues of national economic interest such as the supply and cost of energy to the United States.

    Religious influences

    Obama: Regards people who "cling" to religion and guns as "bitter" . Spent 20 years being mentored and led spiritually by a man who proclaimed "God damn America" from his pulpit. Mysteriously, this mentor completely disappeared from public sight about four months ago.

    Palin: Head of her high school Fellowship of Christian Athletes and for many years a member of the Assemblies of God congregation whose preachers have never been known to accuse the United States of deliberately spreading the AIDS virus. They remain in full public sight and can be seen every Sunday in churches across Alaska. A proud gun owner who has been known to cling only to the carcasses of dead caribou felled by her own aim.

    Record of bipartisan achievement

    Obama: Speaks movingly of the bipartisanship needed to end the destructive politics of "Red America" and "Blue America", but votes in the Senate as a down-the-line Democrat, with one of the most liberal voting records in congress.

    Palin: Ridiculed by liberals such as John Kerry as a crazed, barely human, Dick Cheney-type conservative but worked wit Democrats in the state legislature to secure landmark anti-corruption legislation.

    Former state Rep. Ethan Berkowitz - a Democrat - said. "Gov. Palin has made her name fighting corruption within her own party, and I was honored when she stepped across party lines and asked me to co-author her ethics white paper."

    On Human Life

    Obama: Devoutly pro-choice. Voted against a bill in the Illinois state senate that would have required doctors to save the lives of babies who survived abortion procedures. The implication of this position is that babies born prematurely during abortions would be left alone, unnourished and unmedicated, until they died.

    Palin: Devoutly pro-life. Exercised the choice proclaimed by liberals to bring to full term a baby that had been diagnosed in utero with Down Syndrome.

    Now it's true there are other crucial differences. Sen Obama has appeared on Meet The Press every other week for the last four years. He has been the subject of hundreds of adoring articles in papers and newsweeklies and TV shows and has written two Emmy-award winning books.

    Gov Palin has never appeared on Meet the Press, never been on the cover of Newsweek. She presumably feels that, as a mother of five children married to a snowmobile champion, who also happens to be the first woman and the youngest person ever to be elected governor of her state, she has not really done enough yet to merit an autobiography.

    Then again, I'm willing to bet that if she had authored The Grapes of Wrath, sung like Edith Piaf and composed La Traviata , she still wouldn't have won an Emmy.

    Fortunately, it will be up to the American people and not their self-appointed leaders in Hollywood and New York to determine who really has the better experience to be president. Gerard Baker is US Editor and Assistant Editor of The Times of London. Email: [email protected]

  • Bill R. (unverified)
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    Sarah Palin's most important and critical qualification to be a heartbeat away from the presidency. John McCain announces she is his "soulmate." http://www.crooksandliars.com/2008/08/31/fns-mccain-calls-palin-his-soulmate/

    And... she was vetted by Match.com

  • John Q. Adams (unverified)
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    I am shocked and dismayed to learn the 17 year old daughter of Governor Palin was having UNMARRIED SEX and is now 5 months pregnant

    Clearly the Governor of Alaska needs to devote more time to supervising her children, cooking and cleaning, and caring for her own 6 month old baby. When was the last time she baked chocholate chip cookies? If she can't remember, it's been two long. Leave the politics to the men!

  • johnnie (unverified)
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    Sorry for the double posts.

    The people would rather have Palin a heartbeat away from the Presidency than a lefist radical molded by Saul Alinsky and Bill Ayers.

    Bill R. Gotta love the irony - you post 'crooks and liars' about a person who purged crooks and liars in her State.

    John Q Adams: Watch and learn how to be a good parent. Palin's example in life, politics (politics isn't life), and her family pales in comparison to the hate mongering here in SadOregon.

  • Remulac (unverified)
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    Conservative Republican commentator Tucker Carlson on Sarah Palin: "It is impossible to argue that she is the most qualified person [for the position of Vice President], she's not the most qualified person out there. That clearly wasn't, you know, the main criterion McCain was using in making the choice."

    Trolls: redirect your screeds to Carlson's address.

    Tucker Carlson on TPMtv

  • LT (unverified)
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    Johnnie--you persume to speak for "the people"?

    Reminds me of my favorite history professor (who called himself a Hatfield Republican, btw)

    "Whenever someone talks about 'the American people', substitute the phrase 'people like us' to get the true meaning of what they are saying".

    Johnnie, truth is that Americans like to think for themselves as individuals, not be told what they want.

  • Bob B (unverified)
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    McCain was looking for someone who has reformed government. If resume entirely drove the nomination, Bill Richards would be the Dem candidate. Obama is the candidate for reasons the Dems understand. The Repubs are as confused with Obama's candidacy as the Dems are confused with Palin's. Try arguing for your guy instead of arguing against the other guy - you'll go farther.

  • johnnie (unverified)
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    Rem - who said she is the most qualified? The facts are she is just as qualified and has gotten more done that Obama.

    RE: Corruption - Pelosi and Ried took over the corruption gamit with their offspring becoming lobbiest and changing K-Street into a machine Delay could only dream of.

    LT - just speaking like the Dem ticket, telling everyone what the American people think...

  • johnnie (unverified)
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    P.S.

    One candidate thinks it's a punishment for their daughter to have a baby. One doesn't.

    Palin has turned the entire campaign of the Top of the Ticket vs. the Bottom of the ticket. Pure genius. Pick a veep candidate that shows Obama's inexperience and lack of accomplishments.

    Rem- you can do better than Tucker Carlson. There are many other conservatives out their that don't like this pick as much as the electorate.

    If the criteria for President were beltway experience the Dems would have elected corrupt and racist Byrd as their candidate instead of an absentee first terms Senator. Then again, that's why Obama picked corrupt and racist Biden. MBNA, Lobbyist family, Indians, Clean Articulate African Americans....Biden make Limbaugh seem tame.

  • Remulac (unverified)
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    So glad that's settled. Now we can all agree that it was horribly unfair for Repugs to chastise Obama for lack of experience. It never mattered in the first place! Who would have guessed?! Thanks, johnnie. I do feel so much better now.

    P.S.: Working-class Americans prefer Obama over McCain two to one. Even among white working class Americans Obama has a 10 point margin over his opponent.

  • Harry Kershner (unverified)
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    doretta said, "It doesn't deserve repetition no matter what the substance. It's none of our business, period."

    Too sane for BO, doretta. Here, mass murder, torture and freedom from prosecution for the elites who commit such crimes are all topics less worthy of discussion than sex, relationships, and teen pregnancy.

    Carla said, "From what I've seen since 1994--Republican/conservative "leadership" is an absolute mess. I'll take "elitist" over that any day (and twice on Sunday.)"

    No doubt. However, Republican and Democrat "leadership" are both elitist, and are both anti-democratic. Republicrats' consistent response to criticism is that the other party is worse. Well, you're both worse.

    Jenni: The ordinary people of the duopoly Congress are overwhelmingly rich white men. The power structure that Obama has been pandering to is even richer and whiter. But I'm always glad to amuse.

    Johnnie said, "Kooky Kevin - Why is every screw-up the Kooky left participates in (which everything), ends up being Rove's fault."

    Johnnie: You, like Kevin, wouldn't know "the left" if it bit you in the ass. There is no "left" in America, unless you're talking about those who will be "left behind", which is going to be all of us if we don't radically upgrade our political understanding.

  • johnnie (unverified)
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    Remulac -

    Don't you find it weird the Dems are defending the top of the ticket by pointing out the bottom of the Republican ticket? Very amusing. Do you think there is any difference between the top and bottom of the ticket? Romeny was the best choice, Palin was the smart choice. Palin = energy & contributions.

    By working class do you mean Unionized Labor? When do you think Unionized Labor will adopt secret ballots or are secret ballots an assault on the power, influence and thuggery for the Dem's ticket.

    How many of your working class ride Amtrack with Biden and his $111 each way commute. Very working class of him....

  • Douglas K. (unverified)
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    Like I said - the whole "Palin is raising her daughter's child" story was "unsubstantiated gossip. There was no basis to repeat those kind of rumors in the absence of solid evidence, and now everyone who was pushing it as "fact" now has egg on their face.

  • KJB Eugene (unverified)
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    With the exception of some obnoxious assholes out there, most of us aren't attacking Palin and her daughter personally. Instead, we're just pointing out the blatant Republican hypocrisy here. If Obama or Biden had a pregnant teenage daughter, conservatives would be dancing in the streets. If Obama had picked a running mate with Palin's resume, Fox News would be predicting the end of days right now.

    Oh, and the notion that we're "wetting ourselves" over Palin being picked is something else. If anything, winning back the White House has just become that much easier.

  • Bob B (unverified)
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    "If Obama had picked a running mate with Palin's resume"

    Um, Obama HAS a resume like Palin's. Please argue its merits.

  • Remulac (unverified)
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    The poll which found that working class Americans favored Obama two to one are based, as all polls are based, on voluntary responses by randomly selected respondents. In this case, "working class" was a label applied to low wage workers. Given the level of unionization in this country, I think one can reasonably assume that the vast majority of said "working class Americans" did not have a union card.

    As top- and bottom-ticket comparisons: most of the responses I've read on the Palin pick are about how they reflect on the fellow who chose her. In contrast to McCain, Obama clearly chose someone who would be in a position to assume the reins of power if, heaven forbid, the President should die in office or become incapacitated.

  • LT (unverified)
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    Bob, when has the Gov. of Alaska been on the Foreign Relations Committee?

    Has she ever even met Sen. Lugar, much less worked with him?

    You are right--let's match accomplishment for accomplishment. http://lugar.senate.gov/press/record.cfm?id=267485

  • Gregor (unverified)
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    Super-Pahlin!!!!! Credentials include raising five children in a Christian home where one minor has become pregnant. YUP! She's a super Mom, and she can raise a child with Down's Syndrome, and she can be a Vice President, too.

    C'mon!!! Can you Republicans really hear what you're selling?!?! Have our expectations for VP become so non-existent that one person can have these challenges and be the VP. What is VP, part time at the drive thru?!? And if she was to become President, is that part time too? Have we lowered our expectations so much that this is acceptable? We can't do any better then this?!?

    Frankly, I think she simply has too much on her plate already to reasonably expect her to be able to perform at the level of VP. It's amazing this is even proposed or debated. I've got to admit it's the epitome of self-confidence to think one can do all this, but I'm not buying it.

    All that being said, I do wish her the best with her children: pregnant; challenged; and otherwise. I bear her no ill will, but I'm not able to overlook all that is going on in her family and believe she would make a great VP, or even a good one.

    You've GOT to be kidding!!!

  • KJB Eugene (unverified)
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    sigh Alright, fine. According to Wikipedia:

    *Graduated from Columbia University.

    *Graduated magna cum laude from Harvard Law School; editor and president of Harvard Law Review.

    *Taught constitutional law at University of Chicago Law School.

    *Elected to Illinois State Senate in 1996; helped increase tax credits for low-income workers, helped pass payday loan regulation and fought against predatory mortgage lending, increased subsidies for childcare, sponsored legislation to monitor racial profiling.

    *Elected to US Senate in 2004; worked to facilitate dismantling nuclear weapons in the former Soviet Union, sponsored legislation requiring nuclear plant owners to notify authorities of leaks, sponsored legislation requiring one year's job protection for family members caring for ill veterans, co-sponsored Honest Leadership and Open Government Act, worked on Senate committees for Foreign Relations, Environment and Public Works, Veterans' Affairs, Health, Education, Labor and Pensions, and Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs.

    And I'm leaving a lot of stuff out; I haven't even mentioned his civil rights and community work in Chicago.

    Your move, Bob B.

  • Bob B (unverified)
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    Every senator attaches his name to legislation others authored. Name the legislation that he authored that made it out of the Democratic controlled Congress.

    What decision did he make as a Senator for which he was individually responsible? Don't discount Palin's experience because she doesn't know the "right" people. It's experience of a different kind and is just as valuable.

    Your move, KJB. And save the pretentious sighs please.

  • KJB Eugene (unverified)
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    According to Obama's US Senate Career page on Wikipedia:

    The Lugar-Obama initiative: Expanded Nunn-Lugar cooperative threat reduction to conventional weapons including shoulder-fired missiles and anti-personnel land mines.

    The Coburn-Obama Transparency Act: Responsible for listing all organizations receiving federal funds and breaking down how much was given by what agency and for what reason. Signed into law on September 26, 2006.

    Democratic Republic of the Congo Relief, Security, and Democracy Promotion Act: Signed into law December 2006.

    Obama-Hagel bill to reduce threat of nuclear terrorism. Passed Congress in December 2007 as amendment to the State-Foreign operations appropriations bill.

    Of course, I could list "raised Lazurus from the dead" here and you'll still find a way to show that Palin is somehow magically more qualified than Obama is. Feel like posting any of her credentials?

    And when did working with other Senators to get things done become a bad thing? Isn't that what legislating and governing are all about?

    Oh, and sigh, sigh, and sigh.

  • johnnie (unverified)
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    KJB - you have to be closing your eyes and ears on purpose to not know Palin's credentials.

    Has Obama purged corruption in his Party? Nope, he picked MNBA boy Biden for Veep. Pelosi? Nope she still runs K-Street. Ried? Nope still corrupt as ever with kids lobbying daddy.

    Has Obama submitted and balanced a budget or made any executive branch decision? Nope.

    Has Obama negoitated revenue taxes with Big Oil? Nope. Palin's checks of $1,200 per person is expected to be mailed across Alaska soon.

    Has Obama negotiated a pipeline route with Big Oil? Nope. Palin was considered naive to make demands to Big Oil. She got her way and Alaskans and the rest of America will benefit - even Pickens.

    I don't know why I bother. KBJ's responses show he wouldn't read this anyway. How about this - Palin is a mother of 5 who is a Christian with a pregnant daughter and a downs syndrome child. Is that what you want all you hear? Oh, being a Christian isn't a bad thing - Obama's one.

    Anyone know Edward's "experience or accomplishment" when he was picked as Veep by Kerry? A trial lawyer who bloviated in the US Senate for 6 years, well actually, he was absent too as he ran for President.

    God Bless.

  • Mary from Montana (unverified)
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    I think posing the question about the choices she makes as a parent are valid. The MOST important decisions a parent makes has to do with the wellbeing of their children who should ALWAYS come first! A parent, not a woman, a parent of a 4 month old baby, special needs or NOT, AND a 17 year old pregnant daughter, needs to put their own ambitions aside to focus on their family. It'a about balance. It doesn't mean she gives up the governship to stay home fulltime it just means she doesn't take on additional career obligations at a time her family so obviously needs her attention. I would expect this of a man as much as I would a woman! It is not sexist or anti-feminist to say FAMILY FIRST! Isn't that what "family values" means. Sarah Palin is a rising star in the Republican party. She is young, attractive and by all accounts impressive as the governor of her state. She could have waited a few years to make her debut on the national scene.

  • KJB Eugene (unverified)
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    johnnie:

    "You have to closing your eyes and ears on purpose to not know Palin's credentials."

    Assume that I am. Can you be bothered to get off your ass and list them without spewing insults?

    Oh, and I'm a Christian, too. Hate to break it to you, but it is possible to believe in Christ while realizing that Palin is woefully unqualified to sit a heartbeat away from the Presidency. I've been reading your posts, and you just come off as desperate. McCain just lost this election, and there's nothing wrong with admitting that.

  • Bob B (unverified)
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    Well, I asked you for Obama authored legislation that made it out of Congress. And you found some. I didn't add any qualifying adjectives such as "major" or "influential." He did author something. And I like the "Lazarus" comment regarding the modest nature of his bills. So I stand corrected.

    I'm not going to repeat Palin's resume. It's been all over the press lately. It's been spelled out and dismissed repeatedly on this website. I never contended Palin's work was earth shaking. I simply asked that Palin's efforts not receive the exact treatment you resent when applied to Obama

    And I apologize for criticizing your sighs as pretentious. If that works for you, it's none of my business. It's a private affair.

  • fbear (unverified)
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    johnnie,

    Has Sarah Palin purged corruption in her Party in the sparsely-populated State of Alaska?

    No, Ted Stevens was nominated for yet another term in the Senate.

  • (Show?)

    No, Ted Stevens was nominated for yet another term in the Senate.

    Not only that, but: turns out that Palin had been a director of Ted Stevens' 527, whose name is (I'm not making this up) Ted Stevens Excellence in Public Service, Inc.

  • KJB Eugene (unverified)
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    Breaking news: Turns out that Palin was a member of the Alaskan Independence Party and even attended their convention in 1994?

    "What's so special about that?" you may ask. Turns out one of their key goals is for Alaska to secede from the Union. Guess this means she hates America...

    (Geez, it's been three days and I'm afraid to ask what else can pop up? Didn't McCain do the tiniest bit of research before picking her?

  • Bob B (unverified)
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    By the way, I'd have preferred someone other than Palin. Both Obama and Palin are lightweight. But the hypocrisy on the left and right is thick. Both side's sites are echo chambers for their candidate. It's comfortable but it's not real.

  • johnnie (unverified)
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    KJB wouldn't you secede if the Dem's nominee thinks there are 57 states?

    Palin was for Ted before she was against Ted.

    fbear - consider Ted purged...he's toast. Now what about K-Street Pelosi, Reid, and MBNA Biden?

    We help progressive purge ours (Delay) what about you...?

    KJB - that's some resume you put together for a potential President. Wow, inspiring. Compare his next to McCain and you'd be reading until the Nov. election.

  • (Show?)

    Jack Roberts:

    Of course, we could settle all of this right now if we would all just agree that both John McCain and Joe Biden are qualified to be president, while Sarah Palin and Barack Obama are not.

    This is the purpose of choosing Sarah Palin, along with her extreme right positions to shore up McCain's support & turnout from that large part of the RP.

    The Rs want to frame the election as about experience, and making Sarah Palin's experience our focus gives them their preferred frame.

    Sarah Palin is a tar baby trap, and too many of us are falling for it.

    The question is judgment. Obama's judgment is better than McCain's. That's the case we have to make. Charlie is right that this choice speaks to McCain's judgment, but we need to get down to all the other problems with it.

    Jack R. -- the difference between Howard Dean and Obama on the one hand and Sarah Palin on the other is that they ran long campaigns and garnered votes on a national scale. Dean lost, but was able to generate wide support both at the grassroots and within the party official structure. Palin was just chosen by McCain. If she had launched a presidential bid, would she have been able to gain similar scale support?

    But you are quite right that the size of where she comes from or the college she attended are irrelevant.

    But Rs are just as elitist in different ways. Four types of R elitism come to mind: 1) above all, practical elitism in policies explicitly designed to benefit the wealthy base (cf. GWB's quote made famous by Michael Moore's circulating film of his saying it: "Some people call you the elite. I call you my base," to huge" admission fee fundraising dinner) at the expense of policies to benefit ordinary people; 2) anti-participation elitism, both practical -- voter suppression efforts targeted on lower & lower middle income communities, with a racial inflection often -- and intellectual/ ideological accusations that the polity is better off certain categories of people stay uninvolved (the late William F. Buckley was a major proponent of that view & has many acolytes carrying on; George F. Will is a popularizer of it); 3) blame-the-victim assumptions about people in difficulties and rejection of any sense of mutual responsibility that isn't tied to protection of private property; 4) conversely, exaggerated claims for own success when achieved, & unwillingness to acknowledge social contribution to enabling such success (in present, or for those with inherited wealth, in the past) -- e.g. Mike Erickson, in a broad sense deserves credit for building a successful business (don't know details) but who also went to college at PSU i.e. benefited from publicly subsidized higher education. Nothing wrong with that, it's good, we should do more of it -- but there's something elitist about taking such benefits & then trying to deny them to others, which lots of Rs do.

  • (Show?)

    johnnie: KJB wouldn't you secede if the Dem's nominee thinks there are 57 states?

    Apparently it's now colon-kisser mythology that Obama thinks there are 57 states. In reality he was joking about his travel schedule.

    By the way, the Beetles don't really believe there are "Eight Days A Week" either.

  • Scott J (unverified)
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    Let's see, this pregnancy cover-up would have to include all members of her family, many hospital staff (some of whom would un-doubtedly be liberals(, relatives, friends and many others.

    Now we hear her daughter is 5 months pregnant. This makes the rumors all but impossible.

    Lastly, have none of you ever seen a woman carry that shows very little? I had a next door neighbor that didn't show any extension of the belly until the 8th month.

    Liberals making this an issue highlights the panic. If you were confident in your candidate (you aren't), this type of trash would be a topic.

    The bigger conversation is Obama's half brother living in a hut in Africa.

  • Harry Kershner (unverified)
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    Chris L said correctly, "The Rs want to frame the election as about experience, and making Sarah Palin's experience our focus gives them their preferred frame." But he said incorrectly, "Obama's judgment is better than McCain's.

    I agree that that's the case you have to make if you want to win, but you'll have to win without the votes of those who are paying attention.

    Obama's decision to pick Biden negates his supposed "better judgment" on the occupation of Iraq. Biden has been one of the leading congressional supporters of U.S. militarization of the Middle East and Eastern Europe, of strict economic sanctions against Cuba, and of Israeli crimes. He was perhaps the single most important congressional backer of the Bush invasion of Iraq. (Biden, Iraq, and Obama's Betrayal)

    Both of these terrible candidates have made awful choices for VP. I know, Obama's choice is "less awful" than McCain's, right? Matt Gonzalez would chew up these hacks in a debate.

  • Kenny (unverified)
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    Pathetic Democrats, McCain picks a woman that is more qualified and accomplished than Obama and all you can do is try to destroy her with a bunch of made up crap, pathetic.

  • Freedom (unverified)
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    Bridge to Nowhere - a Palin scandal?

    The news is reporting that Palin “flip-flopped” on the Bridge to Nowhere, and never sent back the money. The source of these news storeis is a “Mayor Bob Weinstein” of Ketchikan, Alaska.

    Bob Weinstein is an entrenched Democrat. He is Alaska’s longest serving Mayor.

    Bob Weinstein also has an ax to grind against Sarah Palin.

    In May 12, 2008, the Juneau Empire newspaper reported in the story, “Ketchikan mayor says bias shown in road plan” the following:

    Ketchikan’s mayor, angry about the loss of the city’s infamous “Bridge to Nowhere,” is accusing the Juneau-based Department of Transportation and Public Facilities staff of bias against his project and being in favor of the Juneau Access Project. “It has been obvious to me for some time that the Southeast Region of DOT has an emotional commitment to the Juneau Access Project, and has been driving the project forward through the use of what appears to be inaccurate, incomplete and/or misleading information,” wrote Bob Weinstein, mayor of Ketchikan, in a March letter to DOT Commissioner Leo Von Scheben.

    Palin gets nominated, an entrenched Democrat Mayor with an ax to grind against Palin starts a story, the liberal newspapers pick it up, and the Mayor’s accusations become “fact”.

  • RW (unverified)
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    Trying to post an article with MANY good links about the Kilkenny letter and the autoverifier will not allow it even as I, un-botishly continue to be able to discern the tangled sets of gibberish strings. Damn!

  • noname (unverified)
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    i have never heard women that "act" like a lady called bitches. It is usually the bitches that pretend they are "real women" that get called the bitches that they are, because no matter how they try to cover up their greed and craving for power, their bitchiness comes through along with their pure catty jealousy of other real women who cannot sink to the level that the bitches will to get what they want!

  • noname (unverified)
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    <h2>vote for hope for our country. obama/biden 08 ..i do not vote for catty, ignorant, power hungy people who have no regard for the future of this country and my kids and their kids, and mcvain has shown these traits along with his vp pick. Geez! my grown children are more honest and moral than either one of them,(mcvain and pailing)</h2>

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