Countdown to Mukasey: Will Gordon Smith support torture? Or will he oppose it?

Kari Chisholm FacebookTwitterWebsite

Waterboarding is a vile and horrible way to torture someone. Here's a short description, from ABC News:

The prisoner is bound to an inclined board, feet raised and head slightly below the feet. Cellophane is wrapped over the prisoner's face and water is poured over him. Unavoidably, the gag reflex kicks in and a terrifying fear of drowning leads to almost instant pleas to bring the treatment to a halt.

According to the sources, CIA officers who subjected themselves to the water boarding technique lasted an average of 14 seconds before caving in. ... "The person believes they are being killed, and as such, it really amounts to a mock execution, which is illegal under international law," said John Sifton of Human Rights Watch.

So it's pretty disturbing to see Michael Mukasey -- the Bush nominee for Attorney General -- duck, dodge, bob, and weave when he's asked whether waterboarding is torture. After first claiming that he didn't know what it was, and Senate Democrats sent him a letter with a clear definition, he completely avoided the question. From the Washington Post:

Attorney general nominee Michael B. Mukasey told Senate Democrats yesterday that a kind of simulated drowning known as waterboarding is "repugnant to me," but he said he does not know whether the interrogation tactic violates U.S. laws against torture.

It's time for Gordon Smith to stand up and be counted. Will he support Mukasey - and thus support his equivocation about torture? Or will he oppose Mukasey - and deliver a strong message that the United States doesn't believe in torture?

Earlier today, Jeff Merkley demanded that Gordon Smith stand up against torture and against Michael Mukasey:

This is a test of Gordon Smith’s will. Either he stands with the Bush administration and for torture, or he stands with Oregonians and all Americans against the legacy of the last seven years. He needs to let Oregonians know if he will continue to rubber stamp Bush’s cabinet appointments, or if he will finally stand up to the President and help move America forward.

A vote for Mukasey is a vote to continue torture as a policy of this country, and it is a vote to give the President sole authority to determine what is legal and what is illegal. Gordon Smith should think very carefully about which side of the Constitution he wants to be on.

So, what'll it be, Gordon? You for torture? Or against it?

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    Full disclosure: I helped build Jeff Merkley's website, but I speak only for myself.

  • djk (unverified)
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    Well, I think it'll depend. If there clearly aren't the votes to confirm him and he's rejected by a substantial margin, Smith will probably vote him down. And if (somehow), there's enough votes to confirm him by a solid margin, Smith will probably vote him down. It's not like a "yes" vote will make a difference, and an inconsequential "no" vote will help him pretend to be a moderate.

    But if it's right on the edge and Smith's vote actually matters, Smith will almost certainly vote for confirmation.

  • Bill Bodden (unverified)
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    Smith may vote against Mukasey, but only if it will be a token vote and not contribute to Mukasey being rejected. Smith lives in his own privileged world and has little understanding of misery or cruelty when it is inflicted on others. Apparently, he also fails to understand that America's moral authority, never as good as its reputation, is now squandered so that we were unable to criticize the Myanmar junta for the way it put down the recent protests. If ever there was an example of someone auditioning for the job of being Bush's new poodle at the justice-raping department it was Mukasey's performance before the senate judiciary committee. It doesn't say much for Chuck Schumer's judgment that he was one of Mukasey's sponsors. At least Mukasey can count on McCain, Graham and Specter to talk out of the other sides of their mouths when it comes to voting on him.

  • Hawthorne (unverified)
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    "Earlier today, Jeff Merkley demanded that Gordon Smith stand up against torture and against Michael Mukasey."

    And yesterday Steve Novick blogged about the topic himself: http://www.votehook.com/novick_former_colleague_mukasey_stop_torture

    If the target is Smith let's give due credit to the full team of D primary candidates who are keeping the heat on.

  • Billy Joe (unverified)
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    Smith will do what Bush tells him to do. If the Dems beat the nomination, Smith will pretend to be a maverick. He's just trying to figure out which way the wind is blowing right now and won't make a decision until minutes before the vote. If you're expecting a display of courage from him, you'll be disappointed, as usual.

    I'm disappointed in the Democrats since we won the election, but the Republicans are still as pathetic as they always were. They are missing in action in DC and deserve to be fired in '08. Smith is no exception. He's an anonymous, useless, criminal enabler and he's an embarrassment to Oregon, whom he ostensibly represents.

    He does a laughable job 'representing' us in the Senate and I look forward to firing him next year. He can become a lobbyist and make his shilling for corporate interests (often not even Oregon corporate interests) official.

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    Hawthorne -- I agree, but Steve Novick didn't say anything about Gordon Smith in that blog post. Maybe he'll post an update. In any case, we had an entire post about Novick's blog post on Mukasey on Monday.

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    Good on Steve & Jeff for opposing Mukasey & on Jeff for calling Smith out on it, and on BlueOregon for drawing attention to both, as well as for the constructive approach shown by Nick Wirth in his descriptions of both candidates' appearances at Lewis & Clark.

    We should contact Smith and tell him we are watching him on this one.

    It would be nice if Jeff and Steve would issue a call to their supporters, ideally jointly but at least separately, to contact Smith. With a joint call & press release, maybe they could get some media coverage on it as a campaign issue.

    I still think condoning such torture, either directing it or failing to stop it, and failing to direct Mukasey that waterboarding is torture and against U.S. law and policy that he will uphold, are all high midemeanors or high crimes, and thus impeachable offenses.

  • hawthorne (unverified)
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    Kari,

    Thanks. I missed that...

  • Admiral Naismith (unverified)
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    My prediction: He'll come out against torture after voting for it.

    Which will be great, according to him, because that way all sides will feel represented, ha-ha-ha.

    Let's lose this guy. Merkley and Novick both had me at "Hi, I'm a Democrat running against Smith".

  • Jake Weigler - Novick for Senate (unverified)
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    Kari,

    I'm glad that the Merkley camp has joined us in calling out Mukasey for his wink, wink attitude towards torture.

    But just to set the record straight - if you read the post Hawthorne highlighted, you will see it includes a call to action on that included Smith, Wyden and the rest of the Senate. Just keeping 'ya honest buddy.

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    Sure, Jake. It calls on "all members of the Senate" - but didn't name Smith (or Wyden) directly. Trust me, I looked. I wanted to copy and paste the sentence about Smith. But it wasn't there. Whatever; y'all got your own entire post.

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    "Sure, Jake. It calls on "all members of the Senate" - but didn't name Smith (or Wyden) directly. Trust me, I looked. I wanted to copy and paste the sentence about Smith. But it wasn't there. Whatever; y'all got your own entire post."

    Actually Kari, it includes a "Take action!" link which gives the info for Smith and Wyden, specifically.

  • Hawthorne (unverified)
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    Kari,

    Whatever; you see now why some people might feel like you are not fully balanced in your coverage?

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    Hawthorne -- When I blog over my own name, I have zero responsibility to be "fully balanced", certainly no more than TJ has to be "fully balanced" on his blog. You may feel free to evaluate my credibility on your own and do what you want with it. (Seriously - would someone explain to me why I'm the only blogger in the state that's supposed to be neutral when I blog over my own name?)

    TJ -- I see that now. I don't think the action item was there when I first posted, but I could be wrong. What's the point?

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    "TJ -- I see that now. I don't think the action item was there when I first posted, but I could be wrong. What's the point?"

    Only that the question was raised about specifically calling for people to contact Smith; you said Novick had not done so. He had.

  • LT (unverified)
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    TJ and other partisans: Please take the Beaver Boundary "Collusion or Coincidence" post to heart. Are the words of a national pundit what Oregonians want to use to choose a US Senate candidate?

    Even primary elections are not won with inside baseball nitpicking. I don't trust Stu Rothenberg to discuss Oregon politics, I don't care if someone didn't post a link someone else thought should be there. I don't think anyone should criticize Kari for not being "fully balanced" on the US Senate campaign. I'm not part of any campaign (neither candidate has inspired me to get involved yet) but I think the coverage has been balanced.

    When Hillary voted for the Kyl-Lieberman Iran amendment, sure she was in the majority but I have more respect for those who voted in the minority. And it is current votes we should be discussing. I'd love to hear whether either Senate candidate would like to associate themselves with anything Sen. Webb has said or done, or freshmen Cong. Walz and Sestak, or Hagel on the war, or Dorgan + Lott on FCC issues. Or for that matter, that presidential candidate Mike Huckabee says we need to talk about health, and not just health care (prevention, lifestyle, etc.).

    There are going to be nomination battles where Democrats vote with Republicans (where is Schumer on Mukasey--are they friends?). Not 100% of Gordon Smith's votes have been stupid--he is not my choice for US Senate but Denny Smith (or Bob Smith, or Wes Cooley) he ain't.

    It would be interesting to know what got to McCain and L. Graham that they now believe it is OK to vote to confirm Mukasey even though they oppose waterboarding. Bush is not used to losing and has threatened to make no other AG nomination but leave an "acting" person in the job.

    There are other issues, from health care to veterans (looking forward to the confirmation of the new Veterans secretary and hope to hear both candidates on that subject) to FCC issues to all sorts of other things.

    Next week, after 49 and 50 are over with (regardless of the result, and I hold out hope for yes on both) people might start looking at US Senate candidates. Will they find supporters saying "Vote for my guy who supports these solutions to problems....". Or people talking on blogs like this about what link was posted or who was first to call for something?

    I liked what Hawthorne said "If the target is Smith let's give due credit to the full team of D primary candidates who are keeping the heat on."

    The goal is finding a nominee to beat Smith, not each primary campaign trying to one-up the other.

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    "The goal is finding a nominee to beat Smith, not each primary campaign trying to one-up the other."

    Actually, the primary campaigns trying to one-up the other is EXACTLY the goal right now. That's how you find a nominee to beat Smith.

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    One-up sure. Beat up? No way.

  • djk (unverified)
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    Dianne Feinstein and Chuck Schumer just rolled over.

    In announcing her support for Mukasey, Feinstein, D-Calif., said "first and foremost, Michael Mukasey is not Alberto Gonzales,"

    Glad to know "slightly better than abysmal" is the modern standard for getting a cabinet seat.

    "I deeply oppose it," Schumer said of waterboarding. "Unfortunately, this nominee, indeed any proposed by President Bush, will not agree with this. I am, however, confident that this nominee would enforce a law that bans waterboarding."

    Schumer, who was Mukasey's chief Democratic sponsor, said the retired judge told him that if Congress passes a law banning waterboarding "the president would have absolutely no legal authority to ignore such a law."

    Well, now I can sleep better. "Promises not to support a particular torture method if there's an explicit law against it" is all that we really can ask from America's chief law enforcement officer.

  • Steve Buel (unverified)
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    Some time ago, following the Canadian sent to Syria incident, I called Smith's office and asked if Smith was against torture. They said they couldn't tell me. I said, "So he could be for torture?" They said they couldn't speak for the Senator. So evidentally he might be for torture. If he was against it wouldn't his aides know it? Seems to me they would.

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    <h2>I asked the same question of his office one time, and got the exact same dodge--and I used the exact same logic: so, the fact that they couldn't say means it was possible he was FOR torture...</h2>

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